Category: Independent Fundamental Baptist

On a normal day, Antioch Baptist Church was a calm, peaceful place, as it usually is in an Independent Fundamental Baptist Church. That is, until someone dares to stand up against the actions of a person of prominence, particularly one who is in ministerial work of some fashion. When that disagreement is voiced, especially in a way that is more public, the wolves come out and attack, all the while portraying their actions as protecting the poor, helpless sheep. A few hours after the evening service, my husband, Matt Olds, noticed he had a missed call and a voicemail from Douglas Stauffer. It was not too surprising, though still anxiety-inducing, considering the recent post, but we had no idea of the harassment that would ensue after that, beginning with this voicemail. [Voicemail is also transcribed below.]

Transcript of Doug Stauffer’s Voicemail to Matt Olds on Sunday, June 3, 2018 

“Hey Matt, this is Doug Stauffer. I just had somebody to bring Crystal’s comments on Facebook to my attention. Um, actually Pastor Ray. I guess somebody brought it to him and I guess some people went to Lula about it. Uh, you know, it’s pretty disheartening for her to be quoting, uh, Matthew 18 about if you have an issue with a brother, take it to them, etc. I’m just dumbfounded how this, these comments can be on Facebook if they aren’t brought to the pastor or the person preaching. I mean, isn’t she guilty of the very thing that she’s saying should have been done all along? And, you know, we probably need to talk as soon as possible. Um, I would suggest that, you know, she probably remove those posts, you know, from Facebook. It’s really, you know, childish, divisive, destructive to the church to air that type of, um, material on the internet. I mean, REALLY? Is that the maturity that she is trying to gain and, and put out there? It’s really quite destructive, divisive and immature, carnal even, for her to put those notes out there. Um, a person preaches. They say things, it doesn’t always, you know, come across exactly the way they would necessarily say it every time.  But um, the people that left that were complainers, and whiners, and left and split because, most of them, had to do with um- whether somebody was dating somebody else. Um, you know, most of that is completely childish. We helped many of the people out, um, beyond comprehension, and then, you know, basically get stabbed in the back.

Listen. We are all for reconciliation. I still meet and talk to those people that left. Um, but I think it was the worst thing in the world that those that are complainers and gripers and destructive in the church left, and I’m upset about it? I’m not. I think it was good for the church. I think that, um, division and divisiveness, um, you know, there’s no place for it in the church. There’s no place for your wife’s comments on Facebook. Um, I’m not going to respond back publicly because I think then that just worsens the situation. I think what she’s going to do is then draw some of those people that have liked her comments to her and then she will create a worse problem, so if she’s truly trying to, uh, help a situation, she’s going in the opposite direction. This will draw complainers to a complainer and she’s going to be guilty of the very carnality that she’s so worried about.

So, anyway, you give me a call tomorrow if you’d like. I know its late tonight. ***-***-**** [Phone number]. Uh, we do need to talk about this, um, as soon as possible. Thanks. Bye.”

In this series, I share my thoughts and opinions concerning these ministers and the events which led to my departure. Click here to continue reading: “Blindsided: Personal Response to Douglas Stauffer’s Voicemail” or click on the link below.

For a list of the complete series, click here.

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After hearing Douglas Stauffer’s carnal message that morning, I grabbed my son and stormed-out of the auditorium- silently, of course- and went downstairs to the church kitchen to inform my husband of the malicious words Stauffer used behind the pulpit. How can a man that is supposedly a Christian have no remorse for such seething words against those godly people? Several of them were still my friends and their hurt was more than evident every time we spoke. Why did our pastor not stop Doug Stauffer, no matter how close he is to him in the ministry? I was too angry to return upstairs for the rest of message, so we gathered up our other children from the nursery and went home for the afternoon. I messaged the Williams’ [name changed for privacy] about the occurrence because they were considering visiting at Bible Conference that year, and they needed to be warned to stay away for the sake of their family.

All afternoon, furious that a supposed man of God would use the pulpit in such a vindictive way for the THIRD time, with over thirty visiting churches, I concocted several ideas for telling Stauffer off, all shot down. It was not like I had the man on a pedestal, considering how he had been entirely deceitful at our expense just two years before when we were about to go on a missions trip, but I did not realize that it was possible to respect him less as a Christian and as a human being. I developed numerous drafts for Facebook posts, all of which my husband shot down because they were unkind.  He was right, though I felt that they were appropriate.

We quietly returned to the evening service to hear Evangelist Ken McDonald preach (great preacher) and left shortly after the service concluded. By the time we got home, I finally had a post toned-down enough that my husband would approve of because I could not stay silent any longer. This had gone on for too long and I could no longer stand by as my friends were torn apart without remorse. My original Facebook post is provided below. I have also included certain comments below because after a friend, Will Hess, a pastor and creator of The Church Split, commented about Matthew 18, I asked Will for clarification on the subject of the chapter. Doug Stauffer and Pastor Andrew Ray repeatedly took this questioning out of context to attempt to accuse me of hypocrisy. They manipulated the truth to falsely portray that I accused Doug Stauffer of not going to the people directly while taking the disagreements directly to Facebook. Despite the numerous times Stauffer and Andrew Ray brought this up, I NEVER accused Stauffer of not following Matthew 18, and that is proven below.

Original Facebook Post on Sunday, June 3, 2018

As we finish the first day of Bible conference tonight, my heart is heavy after racing through a million emotions today. What are we doing with those in our church? How are we helping them? How are we encouraging them? How are we treating those who have gone?

If they are babes in Christ, do they not need admonition and exhortation? If they are carnal and “slurping on milk,” do they not still need the same? How about finding out why. Paul said, “Who hath hindered you?” Obviously, something has hindered someone that is carnal. Or maybe they aren’t the ones that are carnal.

If they have left the church because of sin, are we not yet still required the ministry of reconciliation and trying to help to restore them in Christ, rather than bashing them from the pulpit?

A church split is never a good thing. The quantity going down for the quality to go up isn’t entirely accurate. If at all. It’s not a cutting away of the flesh because that isn’t how God works.

Those that leave, for whatever reason, are usually hurting. Those that are left are hurting. And it surely doesn’t help that spiritual altitude of a church. Bitterness usually ensues on one or both sides and it hurts the cause of Christ.

Will Hess’ Comments to Original Facebook Post

Will Hess: Agreed.
1 Cor 3 though makes clear that disunity is due to worldliness. If people leave a church for any other reason than a strong biblical issue (not one of opinion) then they are causing division and refusing to work in unity and as Matt 18 and many other place make clear… If they refuse to repent…they are to be as a “heathen”

Crystal Olds (me): I know of families in times past (not recently) that have left literally for the sake of unity and to end the discord. Isn’t Matthew 18 about if you have an issue with a brother, take it to them, etc. and then if they won’t hear one, then before two or three witnesses, then let them be accursed?

Will Hess: Crystal Olds, yeah exactly. Paul goes on similar lines, but leaving for the sake of unity is actually entirely contradictory to unity. If others are sowing discord, follow Matthew 18, and the Pastor should always support such.

In this series I share my thoughts and opinions concerning these ministers and the events which led to my departure. Click here to continue reading: “Blindsided: Douglas Stauffer’s Voicemail to my Husband” or click on the link below.

For a list of the complete series, click here.

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“Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offenses contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.“ Romans 16:17-18

Every summer, Antioch Baptist Church hosts a decently-sized King James Bible Conference, and the 2018 King James Bible Conference was no different. We were expecting visitors from over thirty different churches, “featuring Pastors James Knox, Joe Cammilleri, Brent Logan, Tim Crotts, Rob Carlson, Jason Boger, and Noah Broughton, and Evangelists Douglas Stauffer and Ken McDonald.” In contrast to the years before, Pastor Andrew Ray assigned every speaker a passage from chapter three of 1 Corinthians, focusing around the theme of “Learning to Build.” Douglas Stauffer, assigned 1 Corinthians 3:1-3, proudly opened up the conference during the morning service, as was to be expected considering the place of prominence he had developed with the pastor and inner circle. A few minutes in, we suppose that he became hyper-aware of the vast number of open seats and the obvious lack of people attending from our own church. Likely to save-face and cushion his pride, Stauffer went outside of his assigned verses and for a third time from the pulpit, attacked the people that left. This time, however, was especially vicious, as he exclaimed that the mass exodus was “the best thing that could have happened.” Stauffer compared them to babies sucking their thumbs that can still be heard “slurping on the milk.” Watch below to listen to the most carnal message on carnality I have heard in over two decades of being an Independent Fundamental Baptist.

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“A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.” Luke 6:35

According to Douglas Stauffer on January 21, 2018, sometimes we have to be gracious with the preacher, “no matter how truthful it is.” That counts as a public apology, right? People make mistakes? We kept the message in the back of our heads, assuming that Pastor Andrew Ray would likely confront him about it, but on January 28, 2018, just a week later, Douglas Stauffer continued to use the pulpit as a place to express his personal vendetta against the godly, Christian people who left in the fall. During this Sunday School lesson, Stauffer is talking about a second circumcision, and compares the mass exodus at our church to a circumcision, where “the flesh has been cut off…” His comparison is strikingly inaccurate because we lost most of the heart and soul of our church, people who were discerning and understood the balance of truth and love. On the other hand,  it is a distastefully telling analogy that, in my opinion, reveals more of Doug Stauffer’s character.

To listen to the full sermon, click here (excerpt can be found at time 30:10-30:45).

To watch the full video, click here. (Church website has finally removed destructive statements & later changed the setting to private.)

Transcript of Message: The Fall of Jericho: Joshua 5:1-15
January 28, 2018, Doug Stauffer, Antioch Baptist Church

“[Analogy about a Ketchup bottle called Anticipation] …. But it’s anticipation. Something great is going to happen. You know what I think here at Antioch? Something great’s gonna happen. How many of you are anticipating that? ‘Well, look at what just happened.’ Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. We were circumcised. Think about it. Maybe some of the flesh has been cut off! Okay? Then we’ve got the Passover. Now look what’s getting ready to happen. Everybody’s quiet. [chuckling] Antioch Baptist Church.”

In this series I share my thoughts and opinions concerning these ministers and the events which led to my departure. Click here to continue reading: “Blindsided: Doug Stauffer’s Carnal Message on Carnality- Sermon #3” or click on the link below.

For a list of the complete series, click here.

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Following the exodus, Pastor Andrew Ray openly showed the rawness of his wounded heart while simultaneously trying to strengthen and encourage others. He strongly, yet lovingly, warned about the detriments of gossiping and backbiting, and encouraged the older men and women to each step up and teach the younger men and women. Upon contacting any families that left, we specifically stated that it was not necessary to share any details of what led to them leaving, and they did not share. They were broken and battered, and just trying to pick up the pieces in their families. What could have left such wide-spread destruction to the members of our little church? It was not until January 21, 2018 that we realized that the situations were likely not handled biblically when during the Sunday School lesson Douglas Stauffer, an arrogant and seemingly narcissistic man under the pastor, used the pulpit to attack the godly people that left. In addition to his detestable remarks, Stauffer continued to laugh, stating that we need to be gracious with the preacher because sometimes they say things they should not say, “no matter how truthful it is.” An excerpt of the live-streamed message is provided below with the words transcribed, as well as actual links to the YouTube video and Sermon Audio website.

To listen to the full sermon, click here (excerpt can be found at time 22:47-24:17)

To watch the full video, click here. (Church website has finally removed destructive statements & later made the video private.)

Transcript of Message: Douglas Stauffer, Joshua Crossing on Dry Ground
January 21, 2018, Antioch Baptist Church (Time 22:47-24:17)

“We’d like people to get involved. We’ve got a lot of stuff we’ve got going on. And the more people that get involved, and the more people that get tuned-in, the more people that get, you know, [that they] tune in-err-what do you call it? You get involved? Somebody give me a word. ‘Tuned-in’ is probably the best one I can think of. Plugged-in! Did your wife give that to you? My wife does that. She talks to me and I gotta say it out loud. ‘Plugged-in.’ That’s what I- I was turning the key but it was ‘plugged-in.’ Look, we’d love to see everyone get plugged-in. I think that if you become a member, you ought to get plugged-in. And the question ought to be, ‘How do you want to get plugged-in?’

“He said, he said uh, he drives the cart around and picks up people in the morning for the service because it’s a big church down in Florida. Santa Rosa county I think it is. And he says he goes, so they get in the cart, they’re visitors. He starts driving, and they look, and they say, ‘Man, you look a lot like Mike Huckabee.’ ‘No….’ ‘Oh, you’re Mike Huckabee, aren’t you?’ and he says, and finally he says, ‘Yes, I’m Mike Huckabee,’ and they say, ‘No, you’re not!’ [chuckle] Typical church members! Want to argue about everything! Not really. Not in this church. Not anymore. Chapter 4 verse 1 [laughing]. Sorry guys. I had to say it. It just came to mind. You gotta- you know- you gotta be gracious with the preacher. Every now and then we say things we shouldn’t say.  No matter how truthful it is.

Chapter 4 verse 1, It came….”

In this series I share my thoughts and opinions concerning these ministers and the events which led to my departure. Click here to continue reading: “Blindsided: Circumcising the Critics- Sermon #2” or click on the link below.

For a list of the complete series, click here.

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